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By: [ Editor ] Asked from Sweden

Is there a fitting optimizer out there?

I was looking for a fitting tool program with an optimizer built in.

In fitting programs like EFT and Eve-HQ you input your fitting and it gives you the stats. I'm after a program where you input the stats and it gives you suggestions of optimal fittings. You would be able to put in almost any sort of criteria and it would spit out a solution.

An example:
Input DPS, range, tank-stats and what tackle you want and it gives you a ship and a fitting with suggested implants. Everything based on a prize and on your skill-set. Maybe even based on possible skills you could learn within a certain number of days.

To clarify:
I'm NOT after EFT or Eve-HQ (unless I missed some function in them).
I'm not after a service like Battleclinic loadouts. It's way to brute, isn't based on your skill-set and can't handle ANY question because it only contains a handful of answers.
This question is not about a specific fit. I want a program that could give the optimal fit of ALL that exists based on ANY criteria you give it.
I want a program where you give a question and it gives you the answer.

Does such a program exist?

Add comment viewed 502 times Latest activity about 1 year ago

NN comments
nathan cox
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I see what you’re asking for, but as mentioned below it would be very complicated to implement. So far I don’t think it exists. It may be a good project though if you really want something to calculate all that stuff.

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5 answers

  • 6

nathan cox [ Editor ]

I have searched high and low and can find no such program. I would recommend playing with EFT a lot or just browsing Battle Clinic until you find what you want. I think what you're looking for is more of a Q&A program, where you input what you want and it fits, yes? Unfortunately most available programs are the opposite, you put the modules on and it tells you how they are likely to preform.

NN comments
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  • 3

ecaf ersa [ Editor ]

I agree with Darina that this is clearly possible but extremely complicated, especially given the complex interactions that all the different components involved introduce.

I see difficulties with situations where, for example, different versions of a turret with different ammo could produce similar results for one or more factors, eg. dps and range. You'd need to also specify a level of importance to each element of your "request" in order to try and resolve the algorithms. This kind of thing is looking like a final degree project.

I did once produce a spreadsheet that did something like this in a VERY limited way and only for selecting subsystems for a Legion. It basically computed all the ship attributes for all possible combinations of subsystem which Excel then allowed you to filter by.

My main fit was achieved by filtering first sig rad then speed as this was the direction I wanted to go in. Then it was a case of filtering by the next most important thing and so on till one set of subsystems that gave the configuration I wanted was left.

If anyone wants this (Excel 03) spreadsheet please feel free to e-mail me at ecaf_ersa@hotmail.co.uk and I will send it to you.

As an aside on the topic of fitting tools I always loved the "last slot" facility that Quickfit had. It was just a checkbox that removed any mods that you couldn't fit on the ship taking into account which slots were left free and of course pg and cpu remaining. I wish EFT would implement something like this.

NN comments
darinas
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EveHQ has that last slot functionality. You right-click any remaining slots and it displays all the modules that will fit. Doesn’t hel pthe original question, but this might be something nice for somebody out there.

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  • 3

darinas [ Moderator ]

I can think of many ways of implementing a program like you ask for, but all seem incredibly time consuming and prone to differences of opinion. I think this would be too much work for a non-profit tool.

I've never heard of a program that suggests a fit based on specific criteria, but the fits at battleclinic.com can be searched according to the tags assigned to them, and the available tags do include options for DPS or tank, etc. I think this is the closest you are going to get.

NN comments
annie anomie
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BC is pretty terrible tbh. I always tell people to steer well clear.

werner lucifer
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Thank you. Yes I know of Battleclinic but it offers not nearly what I’m after. It only got a very limited amount of fits; a limited amount of answers. It’s also based on a popularity-contest. It miss stats for everything and it’s very brute. It doesn’t produce an optimal based on an equation. It isn’t based on your skill-set. Etc. If it doesn’t exist it might be a lot of work. Collectively though it would save possible tens of thousands of research hours on fits every year.

darinas
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BattleClinic is not ideal, and in fact many bitter vets consider it the site where you go to find lol-fits. However, it is the closest to your criteria that I could think of. If you are thinking of a community created software application, create a sourceforge.net project for it, and go here to drum up support and developers to help out: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=channel&channelID=3525

mymindisglowing
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I use BC as a starting point and then seek to disprove it using cross references I can find of any kind, including common sense. Some of them are worse than others.

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  • 1

annie anomie [ Editor ]

EFT will do most of what you want but not automatically.

It will tell you the DPS you're doing, the range of your fit and the cost of it.

You after a suicide ganking fit?

NN comments
annie anomie
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Yeah. I could see that wasn’t quite what you were after.

It’s an interesting concept.

Alas, I think the answer would be “Amarr BS” often enough to put people off coding something like that.

werner lucifer
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I clarified the question a bit. I’m not after a specific fit. I know of EFT and Eve-HQ, forums with fits etc. I’m after a program where you input the stats and it gives you the fit. Not the other way around like with EFT and Eve-HQ.

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  • 1

astronomix [ Editor ]

The other issue here is that there is no single best way to fit ships. Everyone has their own way of doing it, and there are many ways to customise fittings for different purposes.

For example, do you fit your Hurricane with 425s or 220s? Some people prefer the 425s on armour fittings, while others like extra tracking on the 220s. And then do you use Warriors or Hobgoblins? Double webs or a single web and a cap booster?

And that's just a Hurricane, which is a pretty simple ship to fit out. Others, like the Dramiel, have many more variations.

The truth of it is there are just far too many variables.

NN comments
werner lucifer
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That’s not on the topic of the existence of such a program but more on the use of such a program. But oh well. I don’t get your point. It’s not about what humans prefer is the best fit. You specify a criteria and if it falls within your criteria it’s presented to you, if you aren’t happy give another criteria. I promise you the computer won’t have feelings about 425s or 220s. Why is it to many variables? To many for what? Let’s say you can’t simplify stuff and end up with 10^18 combos or something like that. Luckily there are whole areas of maths dedicated to finding a good solution anyway.

ecaf ersa
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“I promise you the computer won’t have feelings about 425s or 220s.” That is exactly the problem. These things are easy for a human to resolve or discount…a computer has no frame of reference to resolve these issues in a simple way. Basically you expect a single recipe but EvE does not give you that. This is not WoW with an absolute best way of doing things.

werner lucifer
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Ah. You think the program is thinking for you? Not true. YOU are making the intelligent decision when you input the criteria. You are doing the wishing, you are thinking not the computer. The computer just gives you what fits within those criteria. Depending on the advancement of the criteria you might have to choose from the results also. It’s not replacing the human part, it’s just making it easier.

darinas
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I wonder if you could work out an example, Werner, from basic criteria to all the solutions you are expecting the computer to calculate. (Maybe try small, fast, tackle as criteria?) Then maybe post an answer here to show the answer and your working. Either you will see that the computer can not make logical decisions for the whole process, or we will see that it can.

astronomix
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This is exactly the problem. By the time you input all your criteria, you might as well have fitted the ship up yourself.

Say we take Darina’s example of “small, fast tackle”. Immediately we come across the problem of ship type. Assault ships and interceptors both fit this criteria, as do faction and T1 frigates.

Then you have the question of what kind of tackle you want. Do you want short range scram and web, or do you want a long range point?

Finally, what constitutes fast?

See, you’d have to input so much stuff that you might as well just ft the ship yourself.

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