Hi guys
I'm an eve-noob (but an addict nonetheless) and have recently jumped headfirst into the wonderful world of trading and hauling. I would like to know if anyone has any pro-tips on how to haul your goods between trading hubs safely. I have a couple of my own ideas that I'll post as an answer and would like you guys to add on to:
And so ends my epic first post (of hopefully many) on skill training complete!
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Romain
[ Editor ]
It varies alot depending on what you haul, where you got it, and where your taking it to...
high sec hauling : most of it is just fine in afk mode, the odds of getting suicide ganked are rather thin, especially if you ain't in a huge trade hub (jita and stuff). Just don't go afk with HIGH VALUE STUFF !
low sec : blockade runner is mandatory, unless you wanna get ganked.
courrier contracts : there are many scams in this thing, from people setting high collateral to gank you after to people who set contracts to null sec where you cant even dock. Use contract system for courrier mission with GREAT caution
check the map statistics for recent kills, avoid systems where kills occured in significant numbers in the last hour (significant meaning "how much balls you have when only one kill happened :D).
One personnal note regarding hauling : as a noob player, you might find it not being the most profitable (and enjoyable) thing to do.
As far as I know, these double courier wraps have 50% to be destroyed with your ship, just like one item. It will make any gankers think twice.
Great points Harlock… Though there are many suicide ganks in high-sec space (I’ll post the links later) on commonly travelled routes to Jita from Rens, Dodixie, Amarr, etc. (Aufay is a good example of a system that commonly sees plenty trader/ freighter tears being shed). And as far as the profitability goes… lets just say that I think that markets are the most underrated way of making ISK in EVE. It’s PVP in the market place!!! :)
Ummm…are you sure about the containers being unscanable point? This is not the case in my experience.
Yes, they do. But double courier wraps(make a courier contract, make second courier contract on these wraps) are not scannable.
Interesting…however personally I wouldn’t bother going to such lengths. If a ganker scans you and sees only courier wraps then he knows it’s going to be nice.
Ecaf makes a good point- but it is an added layer of protection if you are hauling highly valuable stuff… If they scan you and see the goods then it’s bye bye valuables. If you double courier wrap it might just cause that one ganker on the route to think twice… and it’s that one ganker who’s the difference between making a profit or taking a huge loss. So as a rule of thumb we could say: don’t double courier wrap a low profit haul but it makes sense on the high end stuff as an added layer?
As far as I remember, courier wrap(or a least double wrap) treated as one item and have 50% chance to be destroyed with your ship. It makes task way less appealing than ganking industrial with 1000x of valuable goodies.
Annie > as I said : depend on what your hauling. High value stuff should be handled accordingly. Beyond that it’s maths… how much do you get killed, how much does go through without problems. If you avoid regular highly camped routes, you should be fine.
Cargos > are they scannable ? I read they weren’t. I ain’t a pirate so I nether tried myself. I also read that they don’t drop… can someone confirm ?
Adding my answers as a comment to this one:
1) Whatever you do… NEVER fly autopilot/ AFK when hauling expensive goods 2) Practice healthy paranoia and keep a firm eye on your local and any yellows/reds that might be on your grid 3) Scout 1 or 2 gates ahead with your alt before making jumps 4) NEVER haul more than you can afford to lose 5) Use different routes/ be unpredictable 6) Travel in a fleet if possible
Good examples of high sec ganks..
High-sec suicide gank on a T1 industrial ship: http://killboard.eveuniversity.org/?a=killdetail&kllid=6496565
A high-sec gank of a Bestower: http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=11462984
Another high-sec suicide gank on a T1 industrial, this one for a 17 BILLION ISK loss: http://killboard.eveuniversity.org/?a=killdetail&kllid=7639374
Tantojack > yes well, if you have 17 billions cargo, you don’t use an untanked, unrigged, unequiped tech 1 transport, don’t you think ? :D
Edited my first message to clarify “afk mode”, whatever you do if you travel in a slow flying industrial, being afk or not won’t matter in case of suicide gank. It’s not like you gonna be able to do something about it :D
Removed the cargo part until someone tells me how it works for sure ;)
amarrahh_42
[ Editor ]
If you train up for an Orca you get a big increase in hauling capacity but it also has the advantage that the corp hangar in the Orca can not be scanned so its a safe place for all your valuable cargo.
Corporate hangars can not be scanned, and items from it won’t drop after ship destruction. Makes every ganker sad, I guess.
This is a great alternative… The only issue is that the Orca is far more expensive when compared to your regular indys, not to mention the fact that you’re training up a host of skills related to mining that you’ll never really use. I think you just gave me an idea for another question though…
D. Sneckner, J.D.
[ Editor ]
The biggest thing I don't see on any of the other lists is to create insta-undocks (instas) outside of all your major stations in your trade routes. This means without fail you want one (way, way, way out) in Jita. I also have them in Dodixie, Auvergne, Aunia, Rens, and any other major places.
From time to time, I risk running highly valuable cargo in a simple industrial (well over 100 million in collateral); I think I do it more for the thrill of beating the gankers than anything else. I've never been popped on a trade run since I started living by the rules expressed within these posts, but I would have been long ago without instas. I'd say second only to unpredictability, there's nothing more important than them.
This is a very good point. Undocking is a vulnerable situation as you can’t turn very quickly, especially in a freighter or industrial, because of the speed you come out at. Having to do a 180 turn in front of the undock ramp of a busy station is a nightmare. + 1
Tony Moore
[ Editor ]
Stunningly nobody has yet mentioned fitting a tank to your industrial.
OK you won't make anything unbreakable but adding one or two Shield Extenders, and maybe a Multispec if you can make the cpu requirement, will make most gankers think twice.
If you don't need all your low slots for Cargo Expanders then fitting a Damage Control will increase your effective hp dramatically, especially as it will at least double the raw damage your hull can take.
I believe that all gankers scan your ship layout as well as your cargo and seeing tanking modules will require them to bring more ships to increase the alpha strike. More likely they'll wait for a softer target unless your cargo is too valuable to resist.
Started off in the game as a hauler-trader. In my experience, the only tank worth fitting on an indy ship is heavy resistance mods with perhaps one mod worth of buffer. I would focus more on sacrificing hull (not armor or shield) strength for agility for a quick align and warp out upon decloaking from a gate, affording no to little chance to be attacked. If practicing healthy paranoia, this method works very well.
That’s a fair comment but I think you’re going to need a lot of inertial stabilisers to make an industrial beat the lock from a sensor boosted destroyer which is likely what you’ll face in a high sec gank. A bigger tank means they’ll need more ships increasing their costs and lowering the potential profit margin.
Another thing to consider is how you’re flying. If you’re auto-piloting in high sec, any kind of active tanking mods aren’t going to help you. In that case, stick with passive mods. The whole idea of tanking an industrial is a bit of a joke. The little bit of EHP you’re going to gain isn’t going to help you much against the kind of dps you’d be facing in a suicide gank situation. Be aware of your signature radius with some shield tanking mods. Go for agility over tank. Getting your align time as low as possible will be far more beneficial to you. Favor Nanofiber over I-stab for sig radius.
Curious
[ Editor ]
If you don't need to much cargo space for hauling, you can consider use of transport ships (like Viator and Occator). Transport ships come in two variants: one can fit covert ops cloaking device and second has increased warp core strength - so you can have somewhat more safety. Also, transport ships have higher warp speed than regular industrial ships.
nashwolfe
[ Editor ]
I don't think anyone else has mentioned cargo value so:
For hi-sec hauling, especially if you're planning on doing it AFK, always make sure that what you're hauling is worth less than what it will cost to gank you.
So for a T1 industrial needing a battlecruiser or 3 or 4 cruisers to gank, stick to 20-30 mil.
For a freighter needing around 10 battleships to gank, don't go over 900mil-1bil.
Simply put, hisec gankers know that they will be concordokkened, so if what you drop won't net them a profit, they won't gank you.
This is a good guideline, but not always certain. Some people gank freighters because they like to do it (the “opening presents on christmas morning” feeling.) Others do it for scoring in an event like the current hulkageddon. And sometimes you can be ganked because someone else is trying to corner the market in the goods you are moving, and wants to eliminate the competition.
Flash Hazardous
[ Editor ]
Reposting my suggestions:
1) Whatever you do... NEVER fly autopilot/ AFK when hauling expensive goods
2) Practice healthy paranoia and keep a firm eye on your local and any yellows/reds that might be on your grid
3) Scout 1 or 2 gates ahead with your alt before making jumps
4) NEVER haul more than you can afford to lose
5) Use different routes/ be unpredictable
6) Travel in a fleet if possible
Done. Thanks :)
Welcome. Remember this is a question and answer site and simply a discussion forum. It’s ok to answer your own question but it’s better to put the answer in an answer and not make it part of the question.
Yeah your tips should be moved from the question to a separate answer post. Allowing some time for Tantojack to fix it before I do anything…