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What's the problem with dual tanking?

Hi all, I see in various blogs and forums that dual tanking (e.g fit a Shield Booster + Armor Rep) is really bad. But with no apparent reasons - like it was obvious - and I can't see why this is so. Any input welcome thx

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3 answers

  • 12

camon bear [ Editor ]

Permit me some rope as I try to answer you question.


Let us take the Maelstrom Minmatar Battleship. It gets a 5% bonus to large projectile RoF and 7.5% bonus to shield booster amount per level of Minmatar Battleship

The Maelstrom has 6 mid slots, and it makes sense to active shield tank this ship as can be seen by the bonuses.

So having fit an active shield tank in the mids, why would you fit an armor tank?

If you fit an active armor tank (armor repairer) then you will not have any cap to run the armor repairer when your shield tank has failed because your shield booster will repair more than an armor repairer and therefore as soon as you have cap you will repair your shields.

If you fitted a passive armor tank then you are using low slots that could have been used to augment your shield tank - Shield Power Relays, Shield Flux Coils and Power Diagnostic units.

The other thing to be considered with shield tanking is speed tanking. If you are shield tanking you can use the lows to increase the speed and/or the agility of the ship to reduce the incoming dps. However a passive armor tank will slow you down and increase the amount of damage you suffer.

Alternatively you can use the low slots to increase your output dps which equates to having to tank for a shorter period of time.


Now let us consider the Hyperion Gallente Battleship. It gets a 5% bonus to large hybrid weapon damage and 7.5% bonus to armor repair amount per level of Gallente Battleship

You would naturally fit this ship with armor repairers. If you fitted a shield booster you would not use it, so that you could save the cap for your armor repairer which will be more effective.

The next thing to consider is a passive shield tank. How much would you gain by fitting shield extenders and invuls against fitting cap rechargers and an AB. With an AB you can reduce the incoming dps. The cap rechargers/cap batteries will increase the amount of time you can run your armor repairer which as we can see is more effective.


Hope this all makes sense so far.

So why not passive tank shield and armor?

Typically a passive/buffer armor tank is for PvP, which means you want to keep your mids free for MWD, E-War (points/scrams/ecm/webs/TP/TD etc) and cap boosters.

The most common place to see a passive shield tank are on drakes and Caldari command ships. This is because they get a bonus to shield resists and have shields large enough to get a decent shield recharge at peak recharge point. As shields have a natural recharge, why would you fit an armor tank when you could bolster that shield with the lows available, or increase speed/agility, or increase gank for the reasons explained above.

NN comments
harlock
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What’s a passive armor tank BTW ?

todd ayumbhara
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Buffers with RR support, basically.

harlock
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Also to add : there are several ships with armor bonuses that works perfectly well with passive shield tank. Myrmidon for example…

So bonuses are not the main reason, because in eve there is often a different way to achieve something ;)

Still, dual tanking is impractical for the reasons exposed by the others : other use of slots, bonus (from modules) are multiplicative, so you lose if you mix modules that don’t increase each other, and of course capacitor…

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  • 6

todd ayumbhara [ Editor ]

tl;dr version: Mixing tanks takes a lot of capacitor, uses up too many slots for tank/damage/utility, and works against ship bonuses.

Also, since most tanking modules (except Damage Controls) affect only tank or armor, mixing tanks basically counteracts each other. The overflow shield/armor repair won't move into the other one, and hardeners only work on one.

NN comments
harlock
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Indeed, since bonuses are multiplicative on EvE, you want resistances to be maxed out on one type of tank. That’s one of the biggest reasons against dual tanking.

Capacitor being the other one of course ;) And the over use of slots on your ships being the last one.

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  • 3

darinas [ Moderator ]

You should really concentrate on one form of tanking, and then use the rest of your spare slots to fit a damage control (by far the best single module in the whole game for all types of tanking!), weapons, weapon modifiers, electronic warfare and tackle modules. If you try to fit two forms of tank, or more, you compromise your first tanking method.

Active tanking both armour and shield is obviously wrong as you run out of capacitor really fast so you fit a tank that only really does half a job before it runs out of energy and the other half is incapable of doing anything.

Passive tanking is not so obviously wrong, but is still not good for you. A ship with massive buffer tank is slower because of the armour buffer and so is easier to hit. It is also easier to hit because the shield buffer makes it a bigger target in game mechanic terms (ship signature). The ship has a very large number of total hitpoints, but that number will go down much quicker than a ship with just armour or shield buffer tank because you have made the ship much easier to hit.

You must also consider what else you want your ship to do. Low slots are good for damage, shield and speed modifiers in a shield tanked ship, or armour modifiers in an armour tanked ship. Mid-slots are useful for a MWD/AB and tackle/ewar/weapon modifiers on an armour tanked ship, and shield modifiers on a shield tanked ship. If you fit both armour and shield tanking modules (even those modules that do not affect speed/signature, such as resitance modifiers) you are using slots that you could put to better use to end the battle quicker. End it quick and your tank will not be stressed too much; take too long and your tank may fail before the other guy's, no matter how big it is.

Speed tanking is not good to mix with any other form of tanking, either. Armour tanking reduces your speed and uses up your low slots, and you can fit a much better shield tank if you use low slots for shield recharging and damage controls instead of speed modules. Also, the point in speed tanking is to avoid being hit as much as possible, but both armour and shield tanks make you easier to hit or use up your valuable capacitor energy.

Hull tanking is for heroes, so should never be combined with shield, speed or armour tanks just in case someone calls you a coward. Even if you did mix tanks with hull tanking, you use up low slots in speed and armour tanks, and mid slots for a shield tank, so you will be unable to "hero up" your hull properly or fit enough hull repairers.

All joking aside, the game is setup so ships can do three things: fly, tank and destroy. Concentrate on only one form of each with your ship to maximise your potential survivability and success rates.

NN comments
ankbar
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“End it quick and your tank will not be stressed too much; take too long and your tank may fail before the other guy’s, no matter how big it is.” Right here, this is the best summary of the reasons.

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